230 gr 45 ACP... 1000 fps?

[Guy Miner]

I'm used to 45+P handloads and commercial ammo getting into the 900-950 fps range with a 230 grain bullet. That's a solid step up from the normal 800-850 fps with a 230 grain bullet that much of the commercial ammo I've used manages to produce.

But... 1000 fps? From a standard 5" 1911 and a 230 grain bullet? Hodgdon thinks so!


I've loaded Ramshot Silhouette with a bit less of a powder charge before, and got good results. It's a great powder for the 45 ACP. I didn't ever expect to see a published 1000+ fps load for a 230 gr bullet though. So today I tried it. Yes! From my Kimber, this very load produced an average of 1016 fps! SD and ES were thrown off by one oddly low velocity cartridge - I'll take responsibility for that. Apparently I messed up that one in particular or average velocity would have been higher and the SD & ES figures tighter.

Story should come out in a week or so. Used the Berry's 230 gr hollowpoint, which seems to be a pretty serious self-defense bullet. I've found it available in commercial ammo from two sources: Underwood and HSL ammunition companies.

Just a little tidbit that I thought you handgunner types would appreciate. Story in the works!

Regards, Guy

 

[JD338]

Wow, that's smokin'.
Probably better change out the slide spring for a heavier one.

JD338

 

[TexasLife]

I haven't loaded any +p with 230's yet, but have with 185's that are just above supersonic. I'll check my 230 data and see where it's at? Did you plug the info into ql for reference?

 

[TexasLife]

Wow, that's smokin'.
Probably better change out the slide spring for a heavier one.

JD338

That would be for 230's as that's near +p+ range I'd think.

 

[JD338]

That would be for 230's as that's near +p+ range I'd think.

I've never shot +P loads so I don't know much about them. I'm a 800-850 fps kind of guy when it comes to 45 ACP.

JD338

 

[TexasLife]

I've never shot +P loads so I don't know much about them. I'm a 800-850 fps kind of guy when it comes to 45 ACP.

JD338

That's why I was stating that the 1k would possibly be in the +p+ range as +p should be (going off memory) is up to 930-950ish. I load lots of +p in 9mm and 45acp (no 1911's). I'd question that 1k on velocity as it does seem fast? Very few places I've found offer +p data (so far Sierra and western powders is all). I've never seen any +p+ data. In the heavies there's very little gain in velocity unlike the lightest bullets. 185's can get to 1,200-1,225fps (sometimes more). I only have 2 firearms in 45acp, g21 & g41.........oh, and just got a m/p recently.

 

[Guy Miner]

I haven't loaded any +p with 230's yet, but have with 185's that are just above supersonic. I'll check my 230 data and see where it's at? Did you plug the info into ql for reference?

My post contained a screenshot of Hodgdon's online data. Then I loaded it. Had already used charges a bit below that, so that constituted my workup. I just hadn't loaded the full 8.2 grains. Yes, it's +P level.

Here's a link to Hodgdon's online data center. Super easy to use. Be sure to look up the 45+P not just the 45 ACP.

Reloading Data Center – Hodgdon Reloading Data Center

hodgdonreloading.com

I've also run 185's with Ramshot Silhouette averaging 1162 fps muzzle velocity from the 5" Kimber.

JD338, yes, I'd absolutely recommend going to a heavier recoil spring for this load if you're going to fire very many of them.

Regards, Guy

 

[salmonchaser]

Dang, that kinda changes the game a bit for the 45ACP. Look forward to your report.

 

[filmjunkie4ever]

Impressive to say the least. Those Ramshot powders have turned out well for me too, especially Enforcer which I use chiefly in my .357’s and .25-20!

Depending on who you ask, the original blackpowder .45 Colt ammo brought a 255 grain cast lead bullet 950-1000 fps in the Colt SAAs with a 7.5” barrel. Your 230 grain HP going 1000+ fps should be just as good if not better!

 

[xphunter]

Good Stuff Guy!
My 45's have been ignored for awhile now.

 

[Guy Miner]

Good Stuff Guy!
My 45's have been ignored for awhile now.

Ol' Roy Yeager has inspired me to load some warmer 45's. Easy enough to cope with the 45+P. A little more of a step to the 45 Super & 45 SMC. Then there's the mighty 460 Rowland... That takes a bit more modification, but even it's an easy drop-in conversion and provides mid-level 44 magnum performance.

The ol' short-fat 45 is a fun one for me. This is my 45th year of shooting it!

Regards, Guy

 

[Blkram]

Is this within the pressure rating of all, most, or just some of the 1911's produced?
Should this only be used in more modern 1911's?
I do not recall every hearing/reading about the typical pressure rating of a 1911 pistol, like you do for various rifle actions...

 

[TexasLife]

Is this within the pressure rating of all, most, or just some of the 1911's produced?
Should this only be used in more modern 1911's?
I do not recall every hearing/reading about the typical pressure rating of a 1911 pistol, like you do for various rifle actions...

21k is standard pressure
23k is +p
25k is +p+ (iirc)

 

[Guy Miner]

Is this within the pressure rating of all, most, or just some of the 1911's produced?
Should this only be used in more modern 1911's?
I do not recall every hearing/reading about the typical pressure rating of a 1911 pistol, like you do for various rifle actions...

Texas Life posted some good info re pressures.

With a 1911 in good repair I'd still recommend a stronger recoil spring. Maybe 22# or so? I don't have hard science on that, but the standard 16# spring would be overwhelmed and the pistol could batter itself rather badly. Also, there's a chance of the magazine not being able to keep up with a slide that is cycling too quickly.

But - I saw no problems whatsoever using my 45 Kimber with a 22# recoil spring. It worked fine, and the brass only landed a little bit farther away than standard 45 ACP brass lands.

Guy

 

[TexasLife]

It's almost comical on load data from places that speed is never reached with same barrel lengths per cartridge ir how much difference there is in bc. For a great bullet within a manufacturers stated bc, then they come out with another and lower the previous 1. Are they rechecking at a different altitude? I guess like always when it comes to reloading, start low and work up.

 

[Bruce Mc]

Years ago I loaded up some 200 gr Speer hollow points with Alliant Blue Dot that were over 1100 fps. They were hand bruisers and ended up being of no use to me. That was with a 5" Gold Cup.

 

[Guy Miner]

It's almost comical on load data from places that speed is never reached with same barrel lengths per cartridge ir how much difference there is in bc. For a great bullet within a manufacturers stated bc, then they come out with another and lower the previous 1. Are they rechecking at a different altitude? I guess like always when it comes to reloading, start low and work up.

I'm really not sure what your point is here.

Hodgdon tested the load in a 5" barrel and averaged 1009 fps with a Berry's 230 grain bullet.

I loaded the same powder charge and a Berry's 230 grain bullet. I did use a different primer.

They showed 1009 fps. I saw 1016 fps from my loads. That's pretty doggone close.

BC doesn't matter in a 45 ACP. It's not a long range cartridge at all. That's not what it's for.

So again sir, I do not understand what point you are trying to make.

Regards, Guy

 

[TexasLife]

I'm really not sure what your point is here.

Hodgdon tested the load in a 5" barrel and averaged 1009 fps with a Berry's 230 grain bullet.

I loaded the same powder charge and a Berry's 230 grain bullet. I did use a different primer.

They showed 1009 fps. I saw 1016 fps from my loads. That's pretty doggone close.

BC doesn't matter in a 45 ACP. It's not a long range cartridge at all. That's not what it's for.

So again sir, I do not understand what point you are trying to make.

Regards, Guy

It's all about variances in posted data whether it's bc, velocity, charge weight and oal. I realize it's their test and not sure if any are actually "live fired" like before ql started being used by some manufacturers.