Ballistic Tips on Elk?

[147 Grain]

Just out of curiosity:

Who has first-hand experience with harvesting elk or moose with Nosler's Ballistic Tip - and - how did the bullet perform?

Steve

P.S. My preference in 30-06 is 180-gr. High Energy Partitions at 2,890 fps or 180-gr. AccuBonds at 2,750 fps.

 

[GooseHunter Jr]

I think the AB is the way to go..in my opinion the Ballistc tips would be best for deer, but that is not to day that a Ballistic tip would bring down a elk or a moose with! I shot my 1st elk with a .257 Roberts 121 grain CoreLockt. Either way you cannot go wrong I just prefer the AB's

 

[147 Grain]

I prefer the Partitions or AccuBonds as well, but there are two guides (going against the grain) suggesting 180-gr. Ballistic Tips (BT) in a 30-06 for elk.

They both feel the Partition isn't expanding anymore and acts like a FMJ; I disagree with their observations and just wanted to inquire if anyone ELSE was using BT's on elk.

 

[martinbns]

Anyone that says a Partition doesn't expand anymore doesn't know what they are talking about. they are fantastic bullets. The front half expands just like a normal bullet with the back half penetrating deeply. on www.24horucampfire.com there is a great article on AccuBond in Afica, give it a read. They shoot everything from Duiker to eland (40 lbs to 2000 lbs).
Another thread confirmed by John Barsness talked about the 180 grain 30 calibre Ballistic tip being beefed up enough for Elk/Moose. A local guy here who goes by Stubblejumper on the various forums loves them and shot through both shoulders of a 5x5 elk lsat year with one out of a 300 ultremag at 90 yards. One of the hardest calibres on bullets out there, I ouwldn't use them but Clayton swears by them.

 

[FOTIS]

I prefer the Partitions or AccuBonds.

YUP!

 

[147 Grain]

I've read those good articles and recently corresponded with the authors, who've given great public and personal advice!!!

Steve

P.S. Seems that the front part of a Partition has similar bullet construction to the excellent Solid Base design and that is what I like about Nosler's Flagship round:

1. Front Portion: Ability to fragment like a Solid Base with a hammer-effect causing shock.

2. Rear Portion: Ability to keep on going like a Failsafe or Barnes X.

No other bullet provides the best of both worlds, with the AccuBond being the ONLY design I know of that has similar results (to the Partition). They sure must have done some tweaking and fine-tuning during the 4 1/2 years of research and development.

 

[fredj338]

FWIW, a friend of mine in Montana guided elk/deer hunters for 4-5 seasons. He has seen enough about bullet performance for me to take his advice, which is, the NBT is ok if you can keep impact vel. below about 2500-2600fps. This means long distance or low starting vel. (.308win.). My own wetpack tests prove the bullet just comes apart too fast & penetration is severely limited if you exceed an impact vel. of 2600fps. He hunts his elk w/ .338wm & 210gr NPs, that's good enough recommendation for me. :wink:

 

[JD338]

fred,

338 cal 210 gr PT is a classic for ELK.

30 cal 180 gr BT might work on ELk shoulder shots but why use a BT when there are better choices like AB abd PT.

Regards,

JD338

 

[NOSLER]

It can work but we do not advise it. Better off with AB or PT for Elk sized critters.

 

[Hysider]

A couple of years ago I was hunting with a friend , who had won the
raffle for the Utah Goveners tag for elk, anyway about the 15th day looking
at elk we saw what I thougt was a 390 bull at about 200 yards , My friend
was shootig a 300 RUM with 180gr. ballistic tips his first shot hit him square
in the shoulder and knocked him down he got up and started walking off
the second shot appeared to hit him about the same place which stumbled
him the third shot hit him also but I didn't see where, anyway we looked for
the bull for four days with out finding him . My friend was so upset that he
gave up hunting for 2 years we all swore off ballistic tips after that .
Charlie

 

[7mmfan]

That's a shame, losing a big bull like that, but a wounded elk will go for miles and miles. I've heard Nosler had some problems with the initial run of Ballistic Tips, but have since heard they've made them better. I've had complete bullet failure with the orginal 180 Ballistic Tips in a 308 Norma magnum at 2900fps. I shot a big antelope buck at 250 yards and the bullet came completey apart on the hide. I found the jacket, minus lead on the outside skin of the entrance wound. Was the most horriffic entrance wound I've ever seen. At the shot the antelopel, slighly quartering away, just stood there and then parts of his innards just droppped out of him on the ground and he collasped. No kidding, I could stick a volleyball through the entrance wound. There are too many good bullets out there for elk, the 180 BT is not one of them.

Brad

 

[fredj338]

BTs can be very accurate but in my own tests (I test every bullet I hunt with) the BTs just aren't reliable enough when impact vel. is above 2600-2700fps. So shoot em far away or use a better designed bullet for close impact shots or high vel. magnums. I've only recovered a single NP from a couple dozen animals taken from little antelope to zebra & elk.

 

[Redneck Ron]

Ballistic tip expansion is quick and lethal--that what they are for. The major factors that affect the expansion on is speed and the other where it hits. To much speed on a bullet designed to work on lower range of sppeds you get frangmentatation. I have seen two nosler CT ballistic tips come out of one deer.

The one from a 270 left the jacket in under the lower grissel area under side of ribs and the lead under the skin on the oppisite side fo the deer . The other from .308 (mine) blew a 4 in exit hole in the shoulder area.

So, all the energy that the bullet from the 270 was completely absorbed by the mule deer. But my bullet droped it its tracks because of the area hit.

Do no shoot ballsitic at high rate of speed becasue the will fragement. Partition is a little more forgiveing because they are better designed for deep pentration but then again to much speed can cause problems...there is not bullet for all occasions. There are some good explinations how ballistic tips and partitions work in Nosler Loading manuals. Gave some understanding to me..

 

[jdmason480]

I've never shot an animal with anything but a Nosler bullet. As everyone knows, the partitions have always performed flawlessly. I took a pronghorn with a 120 gr solid base propelled out of a 7mm Rem Mag that was also flawless (recovered the bullet after it travelled through the length of the animal an lodged in the pelvis). Last winter took an elk with 160 gr AccuBond that seemed to perform perfectly.

All that said, I've killed two pronghorn with the 150 gr ballistic tips. One shot was 200yd broadside that hit nothing but ribs. Had an oblong exit wound and shrapnel throughout the chest cavity. I chaulked it up to unkown variables. Then, the next year I shot a pronghorn quartering toward me at 375 yards. Bullet hit the clavicle and essentially exploded with three fragments large enough to exit through the ribs. Both shots dropped the animals in their tracks. Yet, I swore off ballistic tips and was quite pleased when accubonds came out.

Hope that helps,
jd

 

[147 Grain]

I prefer heavy for caliber Ballistic Tips (as Nosler recommends) for hunting applications.

Light skinned animals get a 180-gr. 30-06 Ballistic Tip, while heavier game get 180-gr. AccuBonds or Partitions.

Ballistic Tips (BT's) were designed by Nosler for violent expansion / explosion and medium penetration on light skin type animals like deer.

For most calibers shooting fragile BT's, you're better off using heavier projectiles with bigger Sectional Density's (SD's) than you would normally use for a regularly constructed bullet.

Why?

1. Heavier bullets for caliber are better in a BT because they tone down the violent expansion a bit and still have enough weight leftover for a complete pass-through.

2. The shock-value with the heavier BT will still be more than lighter standard bullets and you get more energy on target.

3. Short range shots also suit the larger round with a higher SD versus lighter weight BT'd bullets with less mass.

4. Raking quartering-away shots obviously benefit from a heavier round for adequate penetration.

5. A larger BT'd bullet is also more forgiving if you shoot accidently into the shoulder.


FYI:

Nosler says that beginning with the 30 caliber 180-gr. Ballistic Tips (and larger), the jacket's profile is changed or upgraded to a much stronger contour similar to the AccuBond (shown below). The lead core is also hardened over the 165-gr. and below bullets.

Lighter weight bullets like 165-gr. 30 caliber and lower (shown below) do not have the thicker contour which starts in the middle of the shell and goes down to the base.

In summary, one might suggest that the 180-gr. Ballistic Tip is simply a non-bonded AccuBond.

Caution:

* Standard bullets generally perform better on deer in lighter to mid-weight sizes.

* Ballistic Tipped rounds are the exception to the rule as outlined in the opening post. Reported problems of a BT blowing up too quickly are generally associated with too light of a bullet.

Steve

P.S.

I like a bullet to perform two things in my 30-06:

1. Violent expansion / shock.
2. Plenty of penetration for a pass-through.

Nosler makes 4 great rounds to accomplish any North American task - listed in order of toughness:

1. Ballistic Tip
2. Solid Base
3. AccuBond
4. Partition

 

[280SWE]

147 Grain

Nosler says that beginning with the 30 caliber 180-gr. Ballistic Tips (and larger), the jacket's profile is changed or upgraded to a much stronger contour similar to the AccuBond (shown below). The lead core is also hardened over the 165-gr. and below bullets.

I don´t know if this is true??

At the nosler webbpage you can read:

Can I use Ballistic Tip bullets for elk hunting?
Ballistic Tips from 6mm thru 30 caliber are designed for medium size game (up to 400 lbs.) using an appropriate caliber. Ballistic Tips from 8mm thru 375 caliber are designed for large, soft skinned game such as elk and moose.

http://www.nosler.com/faq.html

Just what I have found.

 

[GooseHunter Jr]

I pulled this from the FAQ's'

"Can I use Ballistic Tip bullets for elk hunting?"

Nosler's response.

"Ballistic Tips from 6mm thru 30 caliber are designed for medium size game (up to 400 lbs.) using an appropriate caliber. Ballistic Tips from 8mm thru 375 caliber are designed for large, soft skinned game such as elk and moose."



So does this means that the 180 and 200 grain Ballistic Tips will eork well for elk out of my .338 Win Mag??

GHJ

 

[JD338]

goosehunter,

I would use the 200 gr BT in the 338 Win Mag.
I think even better choices would be the 225 gr AB or 210 gr or 225 gr PT's.
Pick the one that shoots the best out of your rifle and don't look back.

Regards,

JD338

 

[GooseHunter Jr]

I plan on using the AB's in 180 and 225...I was a just curious if the BT would be as good in the larger calibers.

 

[baltz526]

on the heavy ballistic tip bullets, 180gr and above, isn't the bullet designed with a thicker jacket wall, to keep the bullet from blowing up on close shots at higher velocitys :shock:

It can work but we do not advise it. Better off with AB or PT for Elk sized critters.