New Sako 85; Caliber??

[ldg397]

I think I am convinced from the previous thread to buy a new sako 85 greywolf, have always wanted one of the greywolfs. The dilemna as always is caliber.

I had a 7 mag and sold it because of the length for Rem 700 mtn in .260 just fits my type of hunting better. I tend to like more of a stalking rifle rather than the real long rifles to hard to manuever on the 4 wheeler, truck, deer stand, woods just about everywhere. I have missed the capability of the 7 mag since I sold it though, although I have killed everything I have shot at up to 250 yards with the .260. I also am not that sensitive to recoil but would rather not take a beating if I don't have to. I will most likely never hunt bears or dangerous game. Mostly antelope, deer, maybe the occasional elk or african plains games <eland but definitely not on a regular basis. Narrowed it too the following.

In stock: 30-06, 270, 270wsm

special order: .308, 7 mag, 300 win, 300wsm

side note: I already have all the brass,powder,dies,bullets for 30-06 and would probably be trading my only 30-06 for this rifle.

 

[Big Squeeze]

I think I am convinced from the previous thread to buy a new sako 85 greywolf, have always wanted one of the greywolfs. The dilemna as always is caliber.

I had a 7 mag and sold it because of the length for Rem 700 mtn in .260 just fits my type of hunting better. I tend to like more of a stalking rifle rather than the real long rifles to hard to manuever on the 4 wheeler, truck, deer stand, woods just about everywhere. I have missed the capability of the 7 mag since I sold it though, although I have killed everything I have shot at up to 250 yards with the .260. I also am not that sensitive to recoil but would rather not take a beating if I don't have to. I will most likely never hunt bears or dangerous game. Mostly antelope, deer, maybe the occasional elk or african plains games <eland but definitely not on a regular basis. Narrowed it too the following.

In stock: 30-06, 270, 270wsm

special order: .308, 7 mag, 300 win, 300wsm

side note: I already have all the brass,powder,dies,bullets for 30-06 and would probably be trading my only 30-06 for this rifle.

.............................................LDG!....................You don`t want some cake and eat it too do ya??? If the Sako Greywolf is the rifle you want, then get that rifle and don`t worry about the length! Or! Buy the Greywolf and cut have the barrel down a bit to fit where you would like! Some compromises are going to have to made somewhere!...........If I were you, I`d go with a 300 magnum for the best versatility from varmits, deer sized game on up.

 

[FOTIS]

7mm mag or one of the 300's. Any way you slice it you can not beat the versatility.

 

[longwinters]

I guess I am not sure what you are really looking for. You got rid of a 7mm because of length and really like the 260. Now I don't know about the model 85's but the 75 Greywolf was quite a heavy rifle even in a 270. My buddy had one, twice, and even though it was probably the most accurate rifle/caliber he had ever had it was just too heavy for him for hunting. Now he has had multiple 75's in wood and synthetic and to us the weights were lighter. So maybe the Sako lite would be a better way to go. But it depends on what you want the rifle for.

If you have a 260 already I would go with the 270WSM. I think it is the best of all the WSM calibers and the one that will last in the test of time. It will give you more range but with a similar weight bullet.

Long

 

[ldg397]

Maybe I need to be more clear. I don't mind the weight but wasn't too fond of the 26" barrel and boss system on my 7 mag made for a very long gun. Greywolf doesn't have the 26" barrel which is a plus to me. I guess I am leaning toward the 300 mag but need some convincing (a little scared I guess, never fired one I just don't want to lay out all this cash for a rifle that is too uncomfortable to shoot on a regular basis, obiously the greywolf weight will help in this regard). I want this to be at worst my backup deer rifle and the go to anything bigger rifle. At best it becomes my go to rifle except for a likely stalking deer hunt in North MO where I hunt deer or a mountain type hunt. Can someone give me some examples of their loading down for a 300 mag to 30-06 etc. This part of the versatility of the 300 mag intrigues me.

 

[GB300wm]

I have a 75 in 300 wm and it just flat shoots. My buddy just purchased a 85 in 300 wsm and I shot 3/4" groups with winchester factory accubonds right out of the box. These rifles shoot. Go for the caliber that you really want though, even if you have to order it. You won't regret it. I chose the 300 wm and I never did.

 

[Big Squeeze]

IDG......................According to the Beretta site, all mag. calibers have a 24 3/8" long barrel listed for the Finn-lites or the Greywolf`s...........I have owned a 300 Win. Mag for 35+ years and recently converted early last year to a 300 WSM compact........The 300 Win. Mag is IMO, is the best all around .30 caliber magnum in existence! Compared to the 300 Wby., and the 300 RUM, its recoil is less! It can be downloaded with excellent accuracy and can be uploaded for the hunts with excellent accuracy as well!..............If recoil is an issue for you, then don`t get too light of rifle! The Sako 85 is heavy enough and not that light and an excellent choice in the 300 Win.........Also, if recoil is an issue for extended range sessions, you can slap on a Limbsaver slip on recoil pad as I do....That will reduce the felt effect of recoil by 40% to 50% in my estimation!

 

[GB300wm]

Ditto Big Squeeze on the limbsaver pad. I could hardly believe the difference, really took the bite out of the magnum. I would make that mod even if you think it is unwaranted.

 

[Guest]

Alright, let me summarize what I've read so far. You had a 7Mag, but it was too long overall. you like your 260Rem, but want something for 'bigger' if the occasion arises. You currently own a 30-06 of some make that you're going to trade on this greywolf.

If it were me, I'd consider getting a 30-06 in the greywolf, if only because you clearly like the round, just not your rifle in that caliber. You're just not going to get huge gains over the -06 until you get up to the 300Wby, but what you really sound like you want is 180gr bullets as an option.

Of course, if you like your current -06, then you should just save up for the greywolf in 7Mag and have it all.

 

[JD338]

I vote for the 300 Win Mag.
You can load it downto a 30-06 level for target shooting and deer hunting or load ot up for the big critters.

JD338

 

[ldg397]

I never had a problem with the recoil on the 7 mag or the 30-06 but I never shot the 30-06 with bullets over 200 grain. In all honesty you don't even really notice it in a hunting situation but at the range. I like the .30 caliber because of the versatility of the bullet weights. I think I have narrowed it down to 30-06, .300 wsm, or 300 win. Re-reading my description the 300 wsm seems to fit the majority of my requirements (short rifle in .30 caliber) How is the 300 wsm compare to the 300win?

My only concern is I love to shoot my rifles quite often so I prefer that they be pleasant to shoot but I understand I may have to give up some discomfort in order to gain more capability. Just haven't shot the .300's and didn't know what to expect. The last thing I want to do is spend 1299 on a rifle and hate to shoot it!!

 

[bullet]

I never had a problem with the recoil on the 7 mag or the 30-06 but I never shot the 30-06 with bullets over 200 grain. In all honesty you don't even really notice it in a hunting situation but at the range. I like the .30 caliber because of the versatility of the bullet weights. I think I have narrowed it down to 30-06, .300 wsm, or 300 win. Re-reading my description the 300 wsm seems to fit the majority of my requirements (short rifle in .30 caliber) How is the 300 wsm compare to the 300win?

My only concern is I love to shoot my rifles quite often so I prefer that they be pleasant to shoot but I understand I may have to give up some discomfort in order to gain more capability. Just haven't shot the .300's and didn't know what to expect. The last thing I want to do is spend 1299 on a rifle and hate to shoot it!!

The recoil is not bad on the 300Win or 300WSM yet more than an 06. But in light of your last sentence I think you should take dubyam's advice and get the 30-06 and you know what you are getting and won't be disappointed.

 

[SakoSteve270wsm]

I would give you my opinion on which caliber but it might be a little biased......... :roll:


With the 06 you can load it down but not up.It will always be an 06 (not a bad thing mind you)

With one of the 30 mags you can load down to 06 levels or up to mag levels.

 

[Guest]

With all this talk about loading down to -06 levels with one of the 300's, I feel compelled to question the accuracy attainable at those levels. I've loaded for and shot several magnums and none of them achieve optimal grouping until you get up closer to the max charge, like in the 95%+ range. Your mileage may vary, and my sample size is only six or seven rifles, only one of which I own, but my experience has been so nearly universal that I felt compelled to comment. Is anybody getting accuracy at reduced charges in the mags?

 

[ldg397]

Excellent question. I have a friend that has a 270wsm and he can only get good accuracy with max loads or a little over max in some cases.

After further research on the 300 mags is this a fair summary. The 300wsm seems to be superior in the lighter weight bullets and the 300 win really shines in the heavier weights. Only thing I have against the 300wsm I am not real big on the new popular thing almost to the extreme. However, if it is a quality round that serves a new purpose I could make an exception. Although in the greywolf it would only save 1" of overall rifle length maybe not worth it.

 

[Big Squeeze]

I never had a problem with the recoil on the 7 mag or the 30-06 but I never shot the 30-06 with bullets over 200 grain. In all honesty you don't even really notice it in a hunting situation but at the range. I like the .30 caliber because of the versatility of the bullet weights. I think I have narrowed it down to 30-06, .300 wsm, or 300 win. Re-reading my description the 300 wsm seems to fit the majority of my requirements (short rifle in .30 caliber) How is the 300 wsm compare to the 300win?

My only concern is I love to shoot my rifles quite often so I prefer that they be pleasant to shoot but I understand I may have to give up some discomfort in order to gain more capability. Just haven't shot the .300's and didn't know what to expect. The last thing I want to do is spend 1299 on a rifle and hate to shoot it!!

..............................................................The main comparisons between the 300 WSM and 300 Win Mag., are very simple!.............First! Given the same barrel length, up to AND including the 180 gr. bullet, the 300 WSM can slightly exceed the ballistic performance of the 300 Win. When using bullets HEAVIER than 180 gr., the 300 Win. has the advantage. Since the 180 gr. can take care of most N/A big game, the 200gr. and 220gr. loadings are seldom used or even needed. However, the 300 WSM is no slouch when it comes to 200 gr. loadings and should be regarded as more than capable for any N/A big game! You can trust me on that one!.........................Second! The 300 WSM accomplishes what the 300 Win. can do, but does so with less powder. That gives the reloader some $ savings there.................................Thirdly! The 300 WSM`s are available in lighter and shorter actioned rifles, which do indeed make life easier in the fields, in the thickets and in harsh terrain while on the hunts. Every ounce in reduction can count over a long hunt! THAT was my main reason for converting to a 300 WSM compact; basically the same ballistic performance (within 4.5% of the 300 WSM 24" tubes velocity), but in a more compact/lighter package!.................................After owning a 300 Win. for years, I had an apprehension for change as many people would. I was no different in looking at the 300 WSM, which by the way, has been out since 2000 or `01. I bought the more compact rifle and the 300 WSM simply came along!........................In the final analysis, you would be hard pressed to go wrong with either! Realistically, there is nothing in the fields or on the hunts that one can do over the other, even with the heavier bullet weight velocity advantage that the 300 Win. has over the 300 WSM!......The game won`t know the difference!.....Like I mentioned earlier, if the 300 mag recoil affects you, then buy a slip on Limbsaver recoil pad for $35 or so! With that, recoil is an easy matter to overcome!........................As far as loading up or down is concerned and accuracy thereof? Remember! Each individual rifle has its own sweet loads; powder and bullet likings and so on. It is up to you to experiment and determine which reloaded combos your rifle likes best. All the recos given to you as far as accuracy and what occurred in the rifles of others, is meaningless, simply because your new rifle, whichever caliber you choose, will have its own ballistic fingerprint! You can use our recos as guidelines but in no way is that going to be the template for YOUR rifle!.................If it were me, I`d stay with the .30 caliber! Between the `06, 300WSM or the 300 Win.???............You definetly have some pondering to do!..... Me? Because of my long bias or favoritism toward them, I`d go with one of the 300`s!!!

 

[bullet]

With all this talk about loading down to -06 levels with one of the 300's, I feel compelled to question the accuracy attainable at those levels. I've loaded for and shot several magnums and none of them achieve optimal grouping until you get up closer to the max charge, like in the 95%+ range. Your mileage may vary, and my sample size is only six or seven rifles, only one of which I own, but my experience has been so nearly universal that I felt compelled to comment. Is anybody getting accuracy at reduced charges in the mags?

I have ten magnums 1-257-300, 2-7mmRem Mag 1-7mmSTW, 2-300Win, 2-300Wby, 1-338Win Mag, and 1-350 Rem Mag. Have loaded and fired for all except the 350 Rem Mag. Never have been able due to slow burning powders been able to load down and get accruacy anywhere as good as when shooting near or at max levels in any of my magnums. Back to my point which has to do with his comment on not wanting a lot of recoil and is not sure and does not want to be disappointed, he should opt for the 30-06.

 

[edh]

OK, I'll muddy the waters a bit more. :twisted: What about the 338 Federal?

If your hunting style is to keep shots not much more than 300 yards, it could be worth a look.

Short action, 22.5 inch barrel, energy equal to a 7mm Mag, and recoil equal to the 30-06. Sounds like exactly what you're looking for.

I chronograph the 180 grain AB factory load at a bit over 2700 fps, which is equal to the standard 30-06 load. The 200 AB clocks in at 2630 fps. This is from a Sako 85 Hunter.

I'm going to load some 225 grain AB at an expected 2400 fps this week. The superior BC of this bullet would make it a 400 yard cartridge for elk, despite the moderate initial velocity (~1700 ft-lbs, at 1800+ fps).

Ed

 

[Big Squeeze]

With all this talk about loading down to -06 levels with one of the 300's, I feel compelled to question the accuracy attainable at those levels. I've loaded for and shot several magnums and none of them achieve optimal grouping until you get up closer to the max charge, like in the 95%+ range. Your mileage may vary, and my sample size is only six or seven rifles, only one of which I own, but my experience has been so nearly universal that I felt compelled to comment. Is anybody getting accuracy at reduced charges in the mags?

I have ten magnums 1-257-300, 2-7mmRem Mag 1-7mmSTW, 2-300Win, 2-300Wby, 1-338Win Mag, and 1-350 Rem Mag. Have loaded and fired for all except the 350 Rem Mag. Never have been able due to slow burning powders been able to load down and get accruacy anywhere as good as when shooting near or at max levels in any of my magnums. Back to my point which has to do with his comment on not wanting a lot of recoil and is not sure and does not want to be disappointed, he should opt for the 30-06.

...........................................................Good point! However there are faster burners out there that can be loaded down for either the 300 WSM or the 300 Win. The best example of this is IMR 4007 SSC which I have yet to try!.... I have read accounts that while the loads were in the process of being worked up to a maximum for their given rifles in 300 WSM, each individual groupings for the reduced loads were extremely accurate in that the bullet holes were all touching each other! The IMR 4007 approaches the velocity of the slower burners and uses about 10 grains less per round; one example I read was 2979 fps. using a 180gr. Sierra with 60.0 gr. of IMR 4007 and without pressure signs.......Reduced loads using the slower burners may not achieve the best accuracy, but reduced loadings using the faster burners,,, just may have a different story???? From all accounts that I have read so far, it seems that IMR 4007SSC may be the most efficient burner for the 300 WSM while within SAMMI and approaches the velocities of the slower powders!......There is also data available on the Hodgdon site for the 300 Win. using the IMR 4007!

 

[bullet]

Good thoughts there BigSqueeze.