Thoughts on the PRC cartridges.

[Brinky72]

I’m a huge fan of smart case design. I love the Creedmoor and truly appreciate the thought put into it. Completely understand that downrange numbers are basically the same as the 260 Remington but, the form and function of the Creedmoor kills the 260 Remington from COAL to twist. Flame away.
I’ve also found interest in the 6.5 PRC and the 300 PRC. They have both followed the example of the Creedmoor to some degree with smart case design. Having a 6.5 Creedmoor I don’t want a 6.5 PRC and a 300 PRC seems more than I would need. Although from what I’ve seen and read it seems to be a very well designed 300 mag. Much is lost on those that don’t understand head height.
So, for conversation sake does anyone here run a 6.5 PRC or a 300 PRC and is willing to share information. And what do you think about a 7 mm PRC based on a 300 PRC with a bumped back shoulder and proper head height to accommodate 180-185 grain bullets. Something like that might make me give up my 280AI.

 

[gerry]

Big fan of the 260 Rem here(3.00" magazine with a 1 in 8 twist sure is nice) but I do have some interest in the 6.5 PRC for a lightweight mountain gun. I miss my old 264 WM and this would be close. It apparently has a case capacity similar to the 6.5-06 which isn't bad. Have no interest in the 300 PRC and would take a 300 WSM over it any day. I'm surprised there isn't much new when it comes to 7 mm cartridges but I bet a 7 mm PRC of some sort is in the works. I prefer 6.5's and 277's over 7 mm myself for the most part anyway.

 

[Blkram]

I am thinking of a 6.5 PRC. Sorry, do not have one yet to share experience on.
I have had a 260 Rem and a 6.5x284 Norma, and still have a 6.5 CM and a 6.5x55 Swede. These last two will stay in my possession and I intend to use them a lot! They are both very accurate and a lot of fun to shoot! Have taken moose and caribou with them respectively (have taken deer, moose, elk and stones sheep with other 6.5x55's in the past).
Have just never really been overly interested in the 264 Win Mag, and with the PRC being so close to it and the Norma, with more of characteristics of the Creedmoor in its design, I think it would make a better choice today.
Seriously looking at getting a Browning X-Bolt in a 270 WSM to rebarrel to the 6.5 PRC, with a 24" barrel (very similar to what I did with a 7mm-08 to get my 6.5 CM; used a Benchmark 5R barrel with 1:8 twist). Really like the laminate stock on the All Weather rifle, and the detachable magazine.
It would be neat to have a rifle with a carbon fibre barrel, but would need to do the build on a different action and stock. If I go this route, it may be a while before it gets done.

I wouldn't be surprised if they do a 7mm PRC, but probably wouldn't get one as my 280 Rem and 7mm STW do a great job and are very accurate.

 

[djauofd]

I have a 260 Rem, awesome round. Rem screwed the pouch by not marketing the round. I would take the 260 up to 147 gr bullets over the Creedmoor. The real advantage of the Creedmoor is the possible development of very high long BC bullets. Say like the 150 SMK’s. But then your into custom twist rate barrels and builds. It would certainly make sense if the interest was to stretch the platform to extreme long range but a 260 Rem 140 plus gr bullet take your pick is a viable cartridge out to way further than I would ever shoot. At standard configurations you can slide a piece of paper between the performance of these two cartridges. Just a matter of preference.

As far as the 6.5 PRC or the 300 PRC it’s just marketing. There are already cartridges that offer similar if not better performance. The real thing I think here about the PRC line of cartridges is that you can get pretty extreme performance with off the shelf ammunition that is readily available and at a reasonable price. To this end they (Hornady) has done a great job. Yes, it makes great sense from a business model perspective. I applaud them.

However, I am not a follower so I draw different conclusions. To me it’s about creating your own better mouse trap.. Hence my builds. Loved 270 win. This was my first real high power rifle. The platform for longer ranged was limited by its twist rate. Holding it to 150 gr bullets. However, if you change the twist rate and go to 1x8 twist, it’s a whole new world. Hence I built a 1x8 twist 26” Sendero profiled rifle. It fires Berger 170 gr EOL Hunters at 2,900 FPS. That makes it supersonic to 1,720 yds at sea level with 1,159 ft lbs at 1,000 yds. Not the 270 your father had. Makes it a whole new world.

So next I wanted to play in the 7mm sandbox and I built a custom 28” Sendero profile 1x8 twist custom chambered 284 win. Allows me to load 197 gr SMK’s to 3.45”. 2,724 FPS get you 1,300 ft lbs at a 1,000 yds supersonic to 1,900 yds. So these are extreme rifle built off of standard cartridges. Of course none of this AMMO is off the shelf. Everything is custom barrels with custom chamberings. You hand load everything. Not exactly a mass market business model.

But for mass marketing, offering incredibly efficient accurate long range capable cartridge, I really believe Hornady has hit the nail on the head. This business model of providing hyper performance cartridges with off the shelf available cost effective cartridges is very appealing. If I were not a tinkerer. I would be all in. You could not go wrong. It delivers what it is designed to do. Just not my gig.




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[Brinky72]

Big fan of the 260 Rem here(3.00" magazine with a 1 in 8 twist sure is nice) but I do have some interest in the 6.5 PRC for a lightweight mountain gun. I miss my old 264 WM and this would be close. It apparently has a case capacity similar to the 6.5-06 which isn't bad. Have no interest in the 300 PRC and would take a 300 WSM over it any day. I'm surprised there isn't much new when it comes to 7 mm cartridges but I bet a 7 mm PRC of some sort is in the works. I prefer 6.5's and 277's over 7 mm myself for the most part anyway.

I’ve always liked the 260 Remington since it’s inception but, it’s been one of those “always wanted,never had” cartridges . And,of course, Remington did it no favors when they introduced it with a poor twist rate,short barrel and, anemic ammunition. Then along came the Creedmoor and I bought one. It’s very similar and I’m thinking if I would have bought a 260 all those years ago it may have ended my loonism. Perhaps I would have re-barreled it in a faster twist by now but that would have likely been it.

I’m thinking if a 7mm is designed on the PRC case with an 8.5” twist or better, consideration is given to proper head height and, performance lands between the 7RM and the 7 Weatherby I would jump on it. Although it would likely come out in some over sized, over weight package with my luck.

 

[grry10]

The 6.5x55 Swede is timeless but I am also a fan of the 260 Remington. The same with the 7X57 and the 7mm-08. The PRC case is an interesting platform but I do not really see it filling a gap that isn't already covered by another cartridge.

 

[Dwh7271]

Look up the 7 Practical before you neck down the PRC. May be just what you’re looking for. I think Desert Fox on here recently built one so he would be better for actual experience.
The 260 is a terrific cartridge. I agree with the earlier poster that Remington, as usual, did a cruddy job marketing it. Buy some Alpha Brass and you’re good to go. Impressive brass. Twist is the same as the Creed so I must of missed something there.
Ackley the 260 and now you have something. No Creed is going to run with a 260 AI. I have 2 of em. :grin:
I’m a little of a 6.5 nut. I like fooling with them.
On the 6.5 PRC. Cool cartridge and I’ll agree, well designed. Will I probably build one up? Yeah. Although the GAP 4S will outrun it a hair if that’s what you want.
On the 300 PRC. It will probably do exactly what it was designed to do and do it well. Do I want one. Nope. 300 Norma or improved 300 Norma. Ok. Now I’m interested. I like weird cartridges. Or maybe improve the Norma and neck it to 284?
This one intrigues me and one will follow me home someday. Initial reviews have been good on accuracy. 6.5 PRC is one of the chamberings.
https://www.seekinsprecision.com/product/havak.html

 

[Blkram]

I agree on the 300 PRC; no interest here for me. My WSM fills that faster 30 cal niche for me just fine.

But I am just not a big fan of the 30 cal...no offense to anyone...jmho
And I own a 30-30, 307 Win, 30-06 and a 300 WSM...
30-30 cause it is what I harvested my first big game animals with, whitetail does and a black bear.
307 cause it completed my 94 Big Bore set.
30-06 cause that is what my left handed Sako L691 carbine with full length stock is chamberedin, and it the first such factory rifle I have ever seen. Would have been even happier with it in 6.5x55 or 9.3x62.
300 WSM as it was the first custom rifle I ever had built, and they didn't come out with a 338 WSM. (no offense to the 325 but I am a 338 fan, not a 8mm fan. just a preference)

 

[Guy Miner]

But I am just not a big fan of the 30 cal...no offense to anyone...jmho

Why you no good fer nuttin' fellow you! :grin:

 

[Anonymous]

I think the 300PRC is a pretty interesting development. While it really won't do anything for me that my existing .300WSM won't do well, if I were going to look for a .30 cal- I might very well be interested. The ability to get true LR, high BC, heavy bullet performance in a factory rifle and ammo is pretty outstanding.

I watched a buddy take a Ruger American, some 6.5 Precision Hunter ammo and a Vortex scope and hit steel at 800 yards after just bolting it all together. That's pretty amazing in my book and the PRC just builds off that type of engineering.

 

[Blkram]

But I am just not a big fan of the 30 cal...no offense to anyone...jmho

Why you no good fer nuttin' fellow you! :grin:

LOL!
Good thing I'm Canadian, eh!
As not being a 30 cal fan would disclude me from being "All American"! LOL
(And my Mom was born in Colorado and raised in Washington)

 

[BiggerHammer]

My small twist to the 6.5 PRC chambering. The reamer arrived about a week ago. Throated for the 131gr “ACE” and Dale Janzen’s 140gr VLD. I’m going to chamber it on a 26”, 7.5 twist.

A real quick size comparison.

On the left in the picture bellow, is a Hornady 7mm 162gr ELD-X. On the right is a .25 cal “ACE” 131gr.

 

[Blkram]

That is sure a long bullet!

Tell us more!
What BC and SD numbers does it have?
And what velocity can you expect out of it?

 

[BiggerHammer]

The Blackjack 131gr 25 Cal “Ace” bullet has a G7 of .330. They were shooting it comfortably at 3200 from a 28” 25-284. The PRC case has 2-4 grs more case capacity than a 25-06 depending on the manufacture of the 25-06 case. The PRC case should flat cruise the super high BC 131 ACE.

 

[gerry]

Interesting variation of the PRC cartridges. That 257 version looks very cool, hope you keep us informed on how it turns out for you.

 

[djauofd]

Just played with ballistics vs my 28” 284 win with 185 RDF’s. I can push a 185 gr RDF out of my 284 win. at roughly 2,850 fps. With a 200 yd zero, at sea level I need a vertical drop offset of 6.7 mills and drift offset of 1.32 mills. This is based upon a 90 degree 10 mph wind. If I go with a 25 x 47 use a 28” 7.5 twist barrel and get 3,200 fps. At 1,000 yds it gives me a drop of 5.4 mills and a drift of 1.24. Supersonic to 1,820 yds. Now that is some serious smack. The 284 win is no slouch. I’m sure the 25 PRC is even faster. Owee!!!! I could just get a Remage barrel and switch it out when I want. I have three Rem 700 Remage builds.


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[djauofd]

Just played with ballistics vs my 28” 284 win with 185 RDF’s. I can push a 185 gr RDF out of my 284 win. at roughly 2,850 fps. With a 200 yd zero, at sea level I need a vertical drop offset of 6.7 mills and drift offset of 1.32 mills. This is based upon a 90 degree 10 mph wind. If I go with a 25 x 47 use a 28” 7.5 twist barrel and get 3,200 fps. At 1,000 yds it gives me a drop of 5.4 mills and a drift of 1.24. Supersonic to 1,820 yds. Now that is some serious smack. The 284 win is no slouch. I’m sure the 25 PRC is even faster. Owee!!!! I could just get a Remage barrel and switch it out when I want. I have three Rem 700 Remage builds.


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opps obviously it is 1,000 yd comparison


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[BiggerHammer]

I’ve been messing around with the .284 also. Just a bit different take on the case behind the bullet diameter. It’s basically a .300 Win Mag case, with minimum case taper, 6.5-284 neck length and a 35 degree shoulder. I set it up for the 180gr Hornady ELD-M’s. The chambering is (7.21 Sage). I have a reamer for the 35 degree mentioned above and a second reamer with a 40 degree shoulder which I have not chambered yet.

I had the rifle spun up just prior to this last big game season. The rifle has taken 5 Mulies. Two of which were mine. The rifle was zeroed at 300 yards. So the first buck was a chip shot at 409 yards. The second only required 12 moa for a 850 yard bang flop.

The chambering has shot the 162gr ELD-X and the 180gr ELD-M very well. Velocities are running with the 7mm Ultra and the 28 Nosler. I own both those chamberings also.

162gr ELD-X @ 3377 FPS


300 yards



7.21 Sage left. 7mm Mag case right.




28” Schneider 3-1/2contour .



180gr ELD-M 300 yards.



180gr ELD-M recovered from just under the off side hide of a Mulie shot at 409 yards.





The “Nag” )) pinned his ears early on and spotted it before I did.



Out here we can go as looooooong as you want to go and/ are capable of.



We keep it cool with the Mulies. Knucks!!!

 

[djauofd]

I’ve been messing around with the .284 also. Just a bit different take on the case behind the bullet diameter. It’s basically a .300 Win Mag case, with minimum case taper, 6.5-284 neck length and a 35 degree shoulder. I set it up for the 180gr Hornady ELD-M’s. The chambering is (7.21 Sage). I have a reamer for the 35 degree mentioned above and a second reamer with a 40 degree shoulder which I have not chambered yet.

I had the rifle spun up just prior to this last big game season. The rifle has taken 5 Mulies. Two of which were mine. The rifle was zeroed at 300 yards. So the first buck was a chip shot at 409 yards. The second only required 12 moa for a 850 yard bang flop.

The chambering has shot the 162gr ELD-X and the 180gr ELD-M very well. Velocities are running with the 7mm Ultra and the 28 Nosler. I own both those chamberings also.

162gr ELD-X @ 3377 FPS


300 yards



7.21 Sage left. 7mm Mag case right.




28” Schneider 3-1/2contour .



180gr ELD-M 300 yards.



180gr ELD-M recovered from just under the off side hide of a Mulie shot at 409 yards.





The “Nag” )) pinned his ears early on and spotted it before I did.



Out here we can go as looooooong as you want to go and/ are capable of.



We keep it cool with the Mulies. Knucks!!!

Awesome rifle. Looks to me from pics you live in high plains at your elevation that round can shoot a long long long way. The most I can throw a 180 ELD at is 2,900 a quick calculation shows your at 2,000 fps out to 1,100 yds sea level which is 300 yds more than the 284. At your elevation that is a long way. Thanks for sharing.


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[djauofd]

Here are some picks of my 284 win

The rifle is a 284 win a Rem 700 Long action, McGowen precision 28” 1-8 twist Sendero profile Remage threading . Mac Gunworks brake. Magpul 700 hunter stock with a bedded recoil lug. Warne 20 mm rail Vortex Viper HST 5-25 x 50. With the 284 win I achieve the 2,900 ft per sec with 59.5 gr of RL 26. So we are pretty efficient. The 284 win is sitting next to my 270 win Berger 170 gr Elite Hunter load I use in my 26” McGowen 1-8 twist. I get about 2900 ft per second out of this round as well. It uses 57 gr of RL26. Both rifles shoot awesome. No place to stretch them out here other than a range hunting here out east is pretty much 300 yds. So I am planning a trip with a friend out to Idaho hopefully this year. We shall see.