What cal for large north american game?

I have always wanted to hunt moose and brown bear. Somehow I will find a way to do it in the not to distant future. I have a 30-06 that I think can do anything but most people would call me crazy if I showed up to hunt brown bears with it :roll: . So If you were to persuade me to buy a bigger gun, what caliber would you recommend and why?

There's an incredibly well respected brown bear guide up in Alaska, name of Phil Shoemaker. You may have read some of his articles in hunting magazines. He also guides for big Alaskan moose.

Among other rifles, he recommends his hunters show up with a .30-06 loaded with heavy Nosler Partitions... Like 200 or 220 grain bullets. If Phil say's that's good enough, well it's good enough for me. I understand ranges are typically not long when hunting brown bear up in Alaska. The few I've seen while fishing could certainly be approached fairly close if a fellow had a mind to do so. Armed with a fly rod, I had no desire to get up close...

I've never shot a brown bear or a moose. Think I'd grab my .375, because if I don't use it for stuff like that, why the heck do I have it? On the other hand, the old .30-06 has never let me down in the field.

Regards, Guy

I'm aware of several Alaskan guides that carry a 30-06 loaded with 220 grain bullets. The extra mass and velocity generated with a 338 Winchester Magnum would make it a good all around cartridge for moose and coastal grizzly. A 30-06 is enough for a large moose, and I don't know that they die much quicker with larger cartridges. I've taken moose with everything from a 7mm RM through a 356 and quite a bit between. All managed to die pretty quickly. If you're comfortable with the 30-06 and you're willing to work within the limitations imposed by the bullet you fire, I'd encourage you to stay with it. Load it up with a good quality, heavy for calibre bullet and take your moose. Discuss with whomever you contract for guiding for bear to see if they have a set limit on calibre size. Of course, it's always a grand excuse for a new rifle to say that you're picking one up for very large game. In that case, it might be time for a 9.3 X 62, a 375 Ruger, a 375 H&H, a 35 Whelen, a 350 RM, a 338 WM, a 325 WSM, etc.

Hmmmm........ maybe I just need to load some heavier lead? ..........Or maybe I just need another excuse for a new rifle :lol:

There are plenty of fellows to advocate for a 9.1 X 63 for moose and brown bear. Might be worth a look. Certainly be an opportunity to pick up a new rifle.

I agree with Doc Mike in that a man who knows how to shoot a 30-06 is a lot more welcome in my hunting camp than someone with a bazooka who flinches on every shot. A 338 is a lot of gun pretty much the threshold of my benchrest shooting tolerances with heavy loads. So if you get one of those or a 375 for that matter make sure its a heavier gun, I am getting rid of a lighter weight 300 Win Mag just because I cannot stand the belt to the chops everytime I fire it. But then again its 2 lbs lighter than my 30-06 of the same make and model. Difference between wood and synthetic I guess. Going to get myself a 300 WSM....that weighs like my 30-06 and I am sure I will never have any reason to look back. I would cast my lot with a 300 Mag if you go for a new gun and like the 30-06 load 200-220 grain premium bullets. You're not likely to be wanting to try shots past 200-250 yards on an unwounded grizzly anyways. Most guides I know just dont like to make a habit of that, there is too much that can go wrong. But as I said, the Doc's advice is always sound...and I agree with his choices.

DrMike had a good list of calibers that would work well. In the 30-06 the 200 gr AccuBond or Partition @ 2600 fps would do a great job on moose and grizz. A guy I just saw tonight while fishing shot a very nice grizzly a few years back with the 200 gr Partition it was a bang flop I believe.

Found a good quote from Phil re rifles for brown bear:

"The bullet I used in my 30-06 last fall was the 220gr Partition. I tested it for penetration against 180 TSX and 200 Swifts in the 30-06, 250gr partitions in the .338, 300gr partitions in the .375 and even a 900gr Woodleigh in a 600 Overkill and the 220 Partition penetrated as deep as anything and much deeper than most.

If I were to recommend THE ONE PERFECT ALASKAN BROWN BEAR RIFLE I would recommend the stainless steel .375 Ruger Alaskan. I keep a couple in camp as loaners."

Here's another:

"Rifles: The 30-06 was large enough to kill the world’ record Brown bear and still is. Bring a rifle you are comfortable with and can shoot well: Alaskan game may be larger than you are used to but proper bullet placement is still more important than muzzle energy and bullet construction more important than bore size. Sight in for 100 yards and bring two boxes of ammunition with heavy premium bullets like Barnes TSX, Nosler Partitions, Swift A-Frames, Federal Trophy Bonded or Woodleighs. If you need or desire a new rifle I recommend the .338 Win or .375 Ruger or H&H. Don’t forget extra scope covers."

Link to his website - which has a tremendous amount of Alaskan hunting info, and some great photos of huge bear & moose: http://www.grizzlyskinsofalaska.com/Hunting.html

Interesting stuff. Wish I could afford a hunt with Phil. Regards, Guy

I haven't been flush enough for such a hunt as of yet. But been fortunate enough to have customers up there, that are outfitters or guides. I have discussed this topic with all of them, and the consenus is pretty much the same. .30-06 with a well constructed 200 gr. (read as NP or other premium), is recommended minimum. .338 - .375 would be all the better,,,but. There main point stressed was, being able to put 2 well placed shots, in rather timely manner, ("always hit'm good twice, no matter what") was the common response. So being accurate and quick, was their main objective. None would allow shots beyond 200yds., no matter how good of a shot the hunter is, with most being 100 or less.
If it ever comes to be for me, I have the 9.3x74R. Which will run the 286 gr. NP, out of the 26" Douglas barrel at 2450fps. Or the .45-70 Marlin with 470 gr. cast at 1600 fps.

One time I was offered a job, helping an Outfitter/Guide up in Alaska, in exchange for a Moose, Brown, Caribou, and Wolf hunt. I thought it was not fair for him, so I did not accept the offer. He gets big money for his hunts. He wanted me to help with the horses and the packing.

Now days with the cost of everything, I do not see myself going 'North', anytime soon.

Expensive proposition to be sure. I visit Alaska every few years, but mostly for the fishing. We do see a few moose and bear while fly-fishing the silver run.

I want to own a 375 Ruger Alaskan some day for just this reason. When I figure out how to afford the hunt, I should be able to afford the rifle also. Add a 2.5x8 Leupold and a good reload with heavy bullets and good to go.

I'll probably never own a 33 or 35 caliber magnum, and it's not because they don't work great. I just figure that anytime I want more than a 300 magnum with a 180-200gr bullet I would want the 375.

bbearhntr":2mx8phcw said:

I have always wanted to hunt moose and brown bear. Somehow I will find a way to do it in the not to distant future. I have a 30-06 that I think can do anything but most people would call me crazy if I showed up to hunt brown bears with it :roll: . So If you were to persuade me to buy a bigger gun, what caliber would you recommend and why?

Click to expand...

...................Most people will under-estimate the 30-06 for the big bears. The secret is in the bullet used.

However with that said as I own a 300 WSM, I still would prefer a 338 or 375 cal for the big bears. Have one of each as well.

Tough to beat the 338's. Myself, I would use my 338 RUM with a 250 gr PT at 3000 fps and not look back.

JD338

Lots of good choices. I will qualify this by stating I've never shot a bear of any kind, but if I were to build a rifle just for bears, it might look a lot like an M70 EW in .338-06 or .35 Whelen. Off the shelf would probably be an SS M70 .338 (maybe a Ruger), unless I could find a stainless .375 M70.

But I would not turn down a hunt if all I had was an '06. 200 or 220 Partitions, 200 ABs, or 180 eTips or TSXs and I'd be ready to rock.

If you like the 30-06 sized cases, I wouldn't hesitate to use my 35 Whelen loaded with 250gr PT's on any bear. It has alot going for it in frontal area, tough, tough bullets and out to brown bear hunting ranges I would not feel handicapped in the least. Matter of fact, it would be a toss up as to which rifle I would take right now if I was going to hunt the big bears. I have a great M70 338 and a great M700 35 Whelen. Both shoot PT's really well and I have little doubt how well they would work. Hard for me to justify having the 375 when those two would work just fine I think. Scotty

338 or a good 375!

I use a .300WSM for everything. Moose are not unduly hard to kill and I've seen them taken with everything from .243 and 30-30 to .416. Shot through the lungs they were all as equally dead. None reacted to the shot regardless, moose are just hard to impress.

Brown bears get my respect and I think the .300 and '06 class are fine given good first shots and the superb bullets available today. If it goes wrong though you'll feel better with a bigger rifle and that's often enough. I've used a .375 in H&H and Ruger but ultimately gave up on them as too impractical since I frequently only hunt bears as a sidebar to more edible critters. I've seen a lot of dead bears shot with the '06...

I dislike the .338 immensely for no sensible reason. I know it makes a good bear and moose gun but most folks with them I know tend to close their eyes before they pull the trigger. One of the sayings here is that the closer you live to town the bigger your rifle gets...don't know about that but I know a lot of bushkins shooting the '06 and 7mag.

Thanks for the great suggestions! I have to admit that I am surprised that my 30-06 has been received so favorably. I have a lot of history with this gun as it was my first ever centerfire and a gift from my dad so I will toy with the idea of loading some 200g or 220g partitions. I do have a lot of confidence in that ol' meat getter! I also have to admit that I often try to use every possible reason under the sun to justify another rifle purchase :shock: . As mentioned before I have no immediate plans for this type of hunt but it is high up on my bucket list and it never hurts to be prepared well in advance!

I suggest your fine with the 06, with bullets on the heavy side of top quality. May I remind you that every game animal on the planet taken with a rifle has been taken with a bow, probable even a hand gun, and defiantly a 06 long before AB, ttsx, or e-tips. Save your money for that extra tag, maybe a mountain caribou. 8)